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happy birthday to you happy birthday to

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you happy birthday dear skeptics earned

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seven years old whoo happy birthday to

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you welcome to the skeptic zone the

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podcast from Australia for science and

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hello and welcome to the skeptics earn

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episode number 360 360 I'll just turn

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around that's better for the 13th of sep

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tember 2015 Richard Saunders here with

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you from Sydney Australia and thank you

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Joe alabaster for singing happy birthday

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to the skeptic zone the skeptic zone is

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70 years old and to help celebrate the

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fact that the skeptic zone and seven

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years old because it kicked off the very

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first episode was recorded at dragoncon

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in 2008 in Atlanta we're going to be

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interviewing somebody I met at that

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occasion Angie matki who was just at

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DragonCon and was driving James the

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amazing Randi angie is an emergency

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physician so she has some interesting

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stories to tell it this time we're going

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to be discussing what dragoncon was like

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this year and the skeptic track there

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and the importance of skeptical outreach

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it's a bit of a theme this week as

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you'll see following that interview it's

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a week in science from our friends at

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the Royal Institution of Australia who

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do pretty damn good outreach themselves

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w WR IA us okay you then we're going to

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be reviewing some of the questions and

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comments put to us last week at the

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australian paranormal and spiritual expo

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where we were doing some more outreach

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in this case we were out reaching out

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reaching outreached mmm too well more or

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less believers in the paranormal at the

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expo which was a very good use of our

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time singing to the choir is great i

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love to do that I love to sing to the

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choir or preach to the converted because

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you always learn something when you do

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it anyway but having outreach to people

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who really believe in the paranormal the

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supernatural can be quite rewarding as

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well so a little bit later in the show

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you'll hear some of the more common

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questions that were put to the skeptics

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at the paranormal Expo then to round off

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the show a short interview i did with a

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a guy here in sydney is part of a

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you relatively new this year new podcast

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the Atheist our now normally we leave

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topics of atheism to the atheists it's

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not our special field and that's fine

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but I thought I'd interview Timothy

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Graham to to see where we cross over

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where we overlap I should say crossing

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over to see where we overlap and the

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obvious one would be things like

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creationism and also it's always

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interesting to hear about a new or

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relatively new podcast which is at heart

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grounded in science and reason so all

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that's coming up this week on the

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skeptic zone but now it's time for me to

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run downstairs see if that skeptics own

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birthday cake is finished baking put on

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some blue and white icing or what do the

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Americans call it icing is called um

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it's called um frosting yeah blue and

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white sort of the colors of the skeptics

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and well I'm doing that I'm doing that I

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hope you enjoy episode 3 60 of the

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and joining me on the line all the way

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from near Pittsburgh but originally

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she's from Atlanta and that's where she

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lives i think it's angie matka hello

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Angie I Richard hi now you are an

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emergency physician which is an

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interesting occupation all in itself and

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I must tell my listeners that we're

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using this weird video system at the

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moment it's not skype its messenger and

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but it's working and there you are in

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your scrubs goodness me you really are

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an emergency physician I really am I

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just got off work it's a 828 in the

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morning in the eastern United States

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amazing I'm so glad you could spare the

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time why I asked you to join us on the

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skeptic zone today apart from the fact

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that we're old friends and I think we've

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probably met first up what an amazing

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meeting or a dragon con or something

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like that it was a dragon card actually

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about what four or five years ago easily

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like that I mean I haven't been there

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for five years so it the time five years

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ago then it's scary so what I've asked

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it to ask you to join the skeptic zone

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today is that I sadly haven't been to

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dragoncon for a while and it's a

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wonderful thing because apart from all

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the weird space stuff and the cosplay

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and the movie stars and the TV stars

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there is such a strong skeptical present

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at dragoncon endure for those people who

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may not know this is the major pop

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culture convention in atlanta georgia

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every year and you were there this time

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and not only you but the amazing Randi

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as well what can you tell me about that

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well you're absolutely right the

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skeptics the skeptic track is in fact

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how I became involved in skepticism I

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happened across this at Dragon Con and

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went to my first talk there and I was

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just dumbfounded because these were my

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people

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and I remember seeing the amazing Randi

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on The Tonight Show back in the 70s and

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he has been a presence of course in

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skeptic meetings and such well Margaret

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Downey who I think you also know

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organizes a parade well our section of

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the parade the dragoncon parade is

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something if you haven't seen

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stormtroopers march and don't be three

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straight then you have not lived anyway

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so we now have a very prominent

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skeptical component to the parade and

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that is Marta thanks to Margaret Downey

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but this is the second year I've

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actually been able to I've had the

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privilege of driving James Randi as our

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honored guest in the parade and as you

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probably remember everyone who enters

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the parade has to be in a costume of

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some kind so this year I actually drove

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him dressed at while I was dressed as a

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crash-test I've seen the photographs and

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that outfit is is extraordinary

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especially considering and I remembered

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it's very well that the the temperature

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and the humidity in Atlanta that time of

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year can be fierce it can absolutely

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wilt the strongest of men and women but

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but this year was beautiful we had

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wonderful weather we had a huge turnout

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there were I think they finally tallied

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up yesterday they announced that there

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were approximately 70,000 people in

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attendance at the adjusted dragoncon if

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you can believe it but the hotels had

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instituted a sort of a traffic watch and

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so it really didn't feel as crowded as

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that as it has in years past even though

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they broke record attendance numbers

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this year but the parade itself there

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are probably 80,000 people lining the

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streets of Atlanta and in fact the city

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of Atlanta requested that the dragoncon

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parade be longer than usual so that they

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could provide more places for people to

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watch the parade it is great fun and I

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really hope that some of your listeners

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get to come to Atlanta and experience it

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for themselves because it really

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completely defies description I

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it's it does you we can talk about it

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from now until next week and give a

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sense of what it's like but unless you

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are there unless you're there surrounded

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by Ewoks and and bookies and and all

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sorts of crazy things from every science

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fiction and fantasy pick at realm you

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can imagine cartoons a lot it's

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something but yes you're right The

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Skeptical track is very important in the

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three years that I was lucky enough to

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go there I spoke at The Skeptical track

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and I met so many people like yourself

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coming along there and it's it's one of

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the best places i think for outreach

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because there's a lot of people come to

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dragoncon who are well gigs to be blunt

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are you adding me to your list I think

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so and amazing guilty and into a large

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pot these are out people I think you'd

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have to agree the curious people the

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people who are in the fantasy and

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science fiction and adventure and stuff

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like that they seem to be a lot of

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natural skeptics there and and is it's a

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great place for them to discover

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skepticism I absolutely agree and there

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are several tracks that have their main

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programming I'm all very close to each

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other and there tends to be a lot of

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overlap between the different tracks of

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course the skeptic track is huge and in

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fact they've had to expand to the rooms

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when you were there it was only in that

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one small room but now they've expanded

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into what was the podcasting track and

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moved that to another section also the

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space track and the science track are

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hugely popular and there's so much

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overlap that is sometimes frankly it's

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hard to get into some of the rooms just

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because the programming is so good the

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quality is outstanding the speakers are

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terrific well I mean I actually gave a

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talk this year but I'm not blowing my

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own horn actually this is my second

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you're giving talks but um good thing so

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much fun the audience is so receptive

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and very intelligent they ask very good

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questions and even when there are some

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sparks between the the ex track you know

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the paranormal track epic track it's

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always fun and it

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and even when a sparks fly a little bit

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it's still in general it's still pretty

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friendly in between I agree and I

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remember going along to some of those

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other tracks especially the space track

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and I was part of the podcasting track

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but I went to the extract for a few

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sessions there I remember James Randi

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went along to once when I was there to

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the extracts oh there's a big cross

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pollination maybe I can say love going

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on there now tell me more about the

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amazing Randi because the last time I

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saw him the very last time I saw Randy

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he was doing magic tricks he was doing

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wonderful card tricks for the last

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skerrick of the TAM people a few months

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ago in Las Vegas how's he going how is

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he well I have to say one of my favorite

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things was when we were driving the car

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or when I was driving the car and he was

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riding behind um to hear everyone

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yelling they they were yelling his name

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they were cheering for him people still

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remember him and they seemed to his

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movie the honest and honest liar they

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they have absolute people are still

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stopping them in the street they're

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still winning photographs with myths so

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nice to see that there's this memory

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that we have as a cola as a you know

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that we have this collective memory most

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of the folks are little on the older

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side by one of my favorite moments was

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when we were getting loaded up to get

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into the parade you know there's a

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staging area and there was this woman

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really beautiful woman she was dressed

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as a ghostbuster and she I could not

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speak she was so excited to see him and

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she was younger she was probably in her

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mid-20s and she just became weak at the

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knees when she saw him it was such a

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huge fan and it was though it was just

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so moving to see this new generation of

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folks who were aware of him and the work

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that he's done and it was exciting to

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see that that has been perpetuated that

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people do remember they're still talking

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about it and so he he was just as

276
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gracious as he always has been he's so

277
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kind he is always willing to stop and

278
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take photographs and to speak to people

279
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and and he still had a still mentally as

280
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sharp as ever

281
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he moves a little slower than he used to

282
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but he's still doing pricks you know our

283
00:12:57,299 --> 00:12:55,119
friend Celeste you award the

284
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caricaturist absolutely she did a

285
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wonderful character of me yeah and she

286
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did what you know why she did one of me

287
00:13:10,559 --> 00:13:07,169
is because I saw the one she did of you

288
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haha well she's so talented and anyone

289
00:13:15,779 --> 00:13:12,759
who's in las vegas please hire her for a

290
00:13:18,479 --> 00:13:15,789
gig because she's fantastic anyway so

291
00:13:21,269 --> 00:13:18,489
she was sitting next to him at dinner

292
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one night and he turned and gay if she

293
00:13:24,329 --> 00:13:22,779
still tells the story because it's one

294
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of her favorite moments from the whole

295
00:13:28,650 --> 00:13:26,979
weekend she said that he turned to her

296
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and kind of in a very conspiratorial

297
00:13:33,960 --> 00:13:31,169
whisper do you want to see a magic trick

298
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that the port right in front of her just

299
00:13:38,249 --> 00:13:35,889
like a regular past the spoon yeah and

300
00:13:40,590 --> 00:13:38,259
she still talks about that he just

301
00:13:44,699 --> 00:13:40,600
cheated he just made her night he

302
00:13:46,889 --> 00:13:44,709
doesn't he does that yeah I'm delighted

303
00:13:48,389 --> 00:13:46,899
to hear that day in his retirement that

304
00:13:52,049 --> 00:13:48,399
he's basically still doing the same

305
00:13:54,719 --> 00:13:52,059
thing you he always does which is surely

306
00:13:56,759 --> 00:13:54,729
should turn up somewhere and be magical

307
00:13:59,069 --> 00:13:56,769
and be and be just the amazing Randi

308
00:14:01,409 --> 00:13:59,079
that's fantastic to hear now let's talk

309
00:14:02,849 --> 00:14:01,419
about the fact that our listeners will

310
00:14:05,579 --> 00:14:02,859
have the chance to meet you because

311
00:14:08,969 --> 00:14:05,589
you're coming to the brisbane convention

312
00:14:11,369 --> 00:14:08,979
oh I can't wait I went through the

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00:14:13,739 --> 00:14:11,379
Australian skeptics in Sydney which was

314
00:14:16,319 --> 00:14:13,749
one of my favorite weeks I've ever spent

315
00:14:18,090 --> 00:14:16,329
traveling and met just the most

316
00:14:22,229 --> 00:14:18,100
wonderful people everyone's so friendly

317
00:14:24,479 --> 00:14:22,239
and welcoming and gracious and I can't

318
00:14:26,789 --> 00:14:24,489
wait to see Brisbane Brisbane is a

319
00:14:28,499 --> 00:14:26,799
beautiful city and we've been talking

320
00:14:30,719 --> 00:14:28,509
about the convention in the last couple

321
00:14:33,029 --> 00:14:30,729
of weeks on the skeptics own podcast so

322
00:14:35,789 --> 00:14:33,039
if you if you can come all the way from

323
00:14:36,869 --> 00:14:35,799
the other side of the planet to attend

324
00:14:38,489 --> 00:14:36,879
the Australian skeptics National

325
00:14:42,960 --> 00:14:38,499
Convention I'm sure our listeners around

326
00:14:44,609 --> 00:14:42,970
Australia can get there as well I'm

327
00:14:46,559 --> 00:14:44,619
delighted you're looking forward to it

328
00:14:48,689 --> 00:14:46,569
because it's a great lineup and I

329
00:14:51,599 --> 00:14:48,699
noticed today you posted somewhere that

330
00:14:54,239 --> 00:14:51,609
you you should be at the skeptic am too

331
00:14:56,609 --> 00:14:54,249
on the Friday before the convention well

332
00:14:58,379 --> 00:14:56,619
since I have lectures are prepared for a

333
00:15:00,210 --> 00:14:58,389
skeptic track I've offered I know

334
00:15:02,220 --> 00:15:00,220
they're often looking for speakers when

335
00:15:05,700 --> 00:15:02,230
we do skeptic camps

336
00:15:07,860 --> 00:15:05,710
in Atlanta and other areas and so I just

337
00:15:09,810 --> 00:15:07,870
if they were looking for some someone to

338
00:15:11,970 --> 00:15:09,820
help fill some time I have a couple of

339
00:15:14,390 --> 00:15:11,980
lectures that are ready to go I tend to

340
00:15:18,570 --> 00:15:14,400
favor the alternative medicine

341
00:15:21,000 --> 00:15:18,580
discussions that obviously just mostly

342
00:15:25,170 --> 00:15:21,010
because I get so infuriated when people

343
00:15:27,050 --> 00:15:25,180
willfully con others out of money when

344
00:15:30,450 --> 00:15:27,060
it comes to health matters in particular

345
00:15:33,300 --> 00:15:30,460
in fact I have you to thank for one of

346
00:15:34,560 --> 00:15:33,310
your power ballots demonstrations and I

347
00:15:37,350 --> 00:15:34,570
think I've mentioned this to you before

348
00:15:39,840 --> 00:15:37,360
I had a patient who actually had what I

349
00:15:42,420 --> 00:15:39,850
suspect as a contact dermatitis from the

350
00:15:45,650 --> 00:15:42,430
the band itself it was an irritating

351
00:15:48,840 --> 00:15:45,660
factor on his arm and he was a very

352
00:15:51,080 --> 00:15:48,850
accomplished gentleman but did not have

353
00:15:54,750 --> 00:15:51,090
the critical thinking skills and the

354
00:15:56,580 --> 00:15:54,760
knowledge and he was very persuaded by a

355
00:15:58,200 --> 00:15:56,590
demonstration very much like the

356
00:16:00,210 --> 00:15:58,210
demonstration that you give on your

357
00:16:02,580 --> 00:16:00,220
youtube video and i managed to

358
00:16:04,770 --> 00:16:02,590
demonstrate it right in front of him

359
00:16:09,900 --> 00:16:04,780
with his wife using my stethoscope as

360
00:16:11,940 --> 00:16:09,910
the as the stimulus and and after I'd

361
00:16:13,560 --> 00:16:11,950
showed him how he had been deceived he

362
00:16:16,350 --> 00:16:13,570
tore that thing off and threw in the

363
00:16:17,730 --> 00:16:16,360
garbage Wow and presumably his rash has

364
00:16:19,770 --> 00:16:17,740
healed I haven't heard from him further

365
00:16:22,020 --> 00:16:19,780
but but i have to thank you for that

366
00:16:26,490 --> 00:16:22,030
very publicly even I've told you about

367
00:16:27,870 --> 00:16:26,500
it before I appreciate that I'm glad I'm

368
00:16:30,330 --> 00:16:27,880
glad the video is still being used

369
00:16:31,830 --> 00:16:30,340
that's fantastic well Angie look I can't

370
00:16:33,450 --> 00:16:31,840
wait to see you again we are old friends

371
00:16:34,920 --> 00:16:33,460
we did meet at dragoncon and you know I

372
00:16:39,750 --> 00:16:34,930
was going through some old photographs

373
00:16:41,580 --> 00:16:39,760
old photographs room watch is 2008 i

374
00:16:45,060 --> 00:16:41,590
think it was i was going through some

375
00:16:46,920 --> 00:16:45,070
files and there you are at in the crowd

376
00:16:48,570 --> 00:16:46,930
at the skeptic track so that's probably

377
00:16:50,820 --> 00:16:48,580
where we met i think when i was giving a

378
00:16:53,130 --> 00:16:50,830
talk and scary well I'm delighted I'm

379
00:16:54,930 --> 00:16:53,140
Derek Colin dunno and these friends do

380
00:16:57,420 --> 00:16:54,940
such a wonderful job there Randy turns

381
00:16:59,220 --> 00:16:57,430
up I'm sorry I can't be there because

382
00:17:00,810 --> 00:16:59,230
apart from the fact it's a lot of fun

383
00:17:02,850 --> 00:17:00,820
we'll just get back to what we're

384
00:17:06,090 --> 00:17:02,860
discussing earlier it's one of the best

385
00:17:08,940 --> 00:17:06,100
outreach places I know you know it

386
00:17:10,350 --> 00:17:08,950
because the battles half done there's a

387
00:17:12,240 --> 00:17:10,360
lot of people there who are interested

388
00:17:14,550 --> 00:17:12,250
in science anyway and then they can

389
00:17:15,810 --> 00:17:14,560
learn about skepticism and outreach is

390
00:17:18,410 --> 00:17:15,820
so important so

391
00:17:21,270 --> 00:17:18,420
I'm delighted that you were there too oh

392
00:17:23,160 --> 00:17:21,280
and yeah and we look forward to having

393
00:17:25,890 --> 00:17:23,170
you come back sometime soon and you're

394
00:17:29,070 --> 00:17:25,900
absolutely right it is it is a wonderful

395
00:17:31,950 --> 00:17:29,080
place to have outreach to all ages even

396
00:17:34,440 --> 00:17:31,960
my kids both teenagers were able to be

397
00:17:37,430 --> 00:17:34,450
on a panel about skeptical teens and how

398
00:17:41,640 --> 00:17:37,440
how do you deal with families that have

399
00:17:45,180 --> 00:17:41,650
mixed mixed belief systems and such and

400
00:17:47,370 --> 00:17:45,190
it was really a fascinating outreach

401
00:17:49,080 --> 00:17:47,380
into other age groups as well as two

402
00:17:52,080 --> 00:17:49,090
people who wouldn't ordinarily attend

403
00:17:53,700 --> 00:17:52,090
the staff tracks that's the idea Angie

404
00:17:57,060 --> 00:17:53,710
can't wait to see you I'll look forward

405
00:17:58,530 --> 00:17:57,070
to seeing you in Brisbane and we can

406
00:18:00,600 --> 00:17:58,540
catch up and I'm sure we'll have an

407
00:18:02,670 --> 00:18:00,610
interesting time I might even interview

408
00:18:04,920 --> 00:18:02,680
you again for the skeptic sound who

409
00:18:07,230 --> 00:18:04,930
knows in fact I will we definitely will

410
00:18:09,030 --> 00:18:07,240
i'll make it a date and will interview

411
00:18:11,130 --> 00:18:09,040
you on alternative medicine can't wait

412
00:18:12,750 --> 00:18:11,140
for that but for now i gotta let you get

413
00:18:14,550 --> 00:18:12,760
to sleep because you've come off a long

414
00:18:16,410 --> 00:18:14,560
shift you're in your scrubs you falling

415
00:18:18,540 --> 00:18:16,420
off the chair there you're so tired but

416
00:18:21,240 --> 00:18:18,550
we do a place she hate you being on the

417
00:18:38,109 --> 00:18:21,250
skeptic turn thank you so much for two

418
00:18:43,099 --> 00:18:40,909
welcome to weaken science from our oz

419
00:18:45,289 --> 00:18:43,109
bringing you the science you need to

420
00:18:46,849 --> 00:18:45,299
know is that blue fuzz you might have

421
00:18:48,799 --> 00:18:46,859
fished out of your belly button but was

422
00:18:54,589 --> 00:18:48,809
his belly button lint and the guys get

423
00:18:56,359 --> 00:18:54,599
up more than women yeah seriously we're

424
00:18:57,979 --> 00:18:56,369
doing this is the question have always

425
00:19:00,919 --> 00:18:57,989
asked ourselves where does it come from

426
00:19:03,079 --> 00:19:00,929
it was always blue today we're finding

427
00:19:06,049 --> 00:19:03,089
an answer believe it or not Australia's

428
00:19:08,449 --> 00:19:06,059
ABC ran a nationwide survey to find out

429
00:19:10,009 --> 00:19:08,459
about Australia's belly button lint they

430
00:19:12,109 --> 00:19:10,019
discovered that men have more belly

431
00:19:14,569 --> 00:19:12,119
button lint and generally the older you

432
00:19:16,310 --> 00:19:14,579
get the more you have most people who

433
00:19:18,529 --> 00:19:16,320
had belly button lint were hairy and

434
00:19:20,719 --> 00:19:18,539
nearly all had an innie belly button

435
00:19:22,759 --> 00:19:20,729
only eight percent of people who said

436
00:19:25,249 --> 00:19:22,769
they had belly button lint had a navel

437
00:19:26,899 --> 00:19:25,259
ring and many people reported that the

438
00:19:28,969 --> 00:19:26,909
production of belly button lint reduced

439
00:19:30,960 --> 00:19:28,979
or disappeared when they got a navel

440
00:19:33,419 --> 00:19:30,970
ring

441
00:19:35,399 --> 00:19:33,429
so that's the facts now let's look at

442
00:19:36,930 --> 00:19:35,409
the theory of what causes it the most

443
00:19:38,789 --> 00:19:36,940
plausible theories that the hairs of

444
00:19:41,130 --> 00:19:38,799
your stomach cause small abrasions in

445
00:19:44,039 --> 00:19:41,140
your clothes causing fabric fibers to

446
00:19:45,570 --> 00:19:44,049
fall off and get trapped the hairs on

447
00:19:47,669 --> 00:19:45,580
your stomach generally point towards

448
00:19:49,919 --> 00:19:47,679
your belly button so natural movements

449
00:19:51,600 --> 00:19:49,929
push the fibers along the hairs into the

450
00:19:53,970 --> 00:19:51,610
belly button where it combines to form a

451
00:19:55,620 --> 00:19:53,980
ball this hair movement theory would

452
00:19:57,419 --> 00:19:55,630
explain the difference between people

453
00:20:00,210 --> 00:19:57,429
with lots of body hair and those without

454
00:20:02,610 --> 00:20:00,220
in fact if you shave your stomach belly

455
00:20:04,470 --> 00:20:02,620
button lint formation reduces belly

456
00:20:06,570 --> 00:20:04,480
button lint isn't only just fabric

457
00:20:10,470 --> 00:20:06,580
fibers though the little balls also

458
00:20:13,460 --> 00:20:10,480
contain skin sweat and dust and now for

459
00:20:15,750 --> 00:20:13,470
fast facts about your belly button

460
00:20:17,970 --> 00:20:15,760
although it has been claimed the ancient

461
00:20:20,010 --> 00:20:17,980
Egyptian stars navel piercing there is

462
00:20:21,840 --> 00:20:20,020
actually no historical evidence of it at

463
00:20:24,029 --> 00:20:21,850
all the belly button biodiversity

464
00:20:25,950 --> 00:20:24,039
project aims to understand the bacteria

465
00:20:28,409 --> 00:20:25,960
in your belly button they've found the

466
00:20:30,390 --> 00:20:28,419
amount and types vary widely from person

467
00:20:32,279 --> 00:20:30,400
to person whether you get an innie or an

468
00:20:34,470 --> 00:20:32,289
outie depends on the scar tissue that

469
00:20:37,169 --> 00:20:34,480
forms when your umbilical cord drops off

470
00:20:38,970 --> 00:20:37,179
and an Australian man holds the world's

471
00:20:41,730 --> 00:20:38,980
largest collection of his own belly

472
00:20:44,669 --> 00:20:41,740
button lint 22 grams collected over the

473
00:20:47,010 --> 00:20:44,679
course of 26 years that's it for this

474
00:20:50,029 --> 00:20:47,020
week in science for more information on

475
00:20:53,909 --> 00:20:50,039
belly buttons goes to the RLS website RI

476
00:20:56,549 --> 00:20:53,919
aus stop org a you follow us on twitter

477
00:21:10,610 --> 00:20:56,559
at ARA oz and like us on facebook i'm

478
00:21:15,900 --> 00:21:13,770
ad hominem begging the question factoid

479
00:21:18,029 --> 00:21:15,910
propagation false analogy false cause

480
00:21:19,860 --> 00:21:18,039
false dichotomy gibberish immunized

481
00:21:21,419 --> 00:21:19,870
hypothesis moral equivalence poison the

482
00:21:24,000 --> 00:21:21,429
well simple modern certitude stacking a

483
00:21:25,950 --> 00:21:24,010
deck and WTF are just some of the

484
00:21:28,440 --> 00:21:25,960
fallacies we provide real life examples

485
00:21:32,330 --> 00:21:28,450
of in hunting humbug 101 a podcast about

486
00:21:47,610 --> 00:21:32,340
bad arguments check it out at www.viki

487
00:21:53,700 --> 00:21:50,180
as you would have heard on skeptic zone

488
00:21:55,740 --> 00:21:53,710
359 Australian skeptics and members of

489
00:21:59,010 --> 00:21:55,750
the skeptics owned there's a bit of a

490
00:22:01,890 --> 00:21:59,020
cross over there we're at the Australian

491
00:22:04,890 --> 00:22:01,900
paranormal and spiritual Expo at the

492
00:22:07,140 --> 00:22:04,900
cashola powerhouse here in Sydney we

493
00:22:09,620 --> 00:22:07,150
were there all day at our skeptic stable

494
00:22:12,480 --> 00:22:09,630
handing out lots of magazines brochures

495
00:22:14,340 --> 00:22:12,490
our $100,000 challenge but more

496
00:22:18,990 --> 00:22:14,350
importantly we were chatting to people

497
00:22:20,970 --> 00:22:19,000
we were talking to people believers mums

498
00:22:23,820 --> 00:22:20,980
and dads everyday people coming to the

499
00:22:26,070 --> 00:22:23,830
expo would come up so would be quite

500
00:22:28,799 --> 00:22:26,080
confused as to why we were there but at

501
00:22:32,460 --> 00:22:28,809
least they would talk to us and we I

502
00:22:37,650 --> 00:22:32,470
think it's safe to say remained polite

503
00:22:39,900 --> 00:22:37,660
come ah charming dare I say and simply

504
00:22:44,010 --> 00:22:39,910
engaged with people and tried our best

505
00:22:45,720 --> 00:22:44,020
to answer their questions what I'd like

506
00:22:47,990 --> 00:22:45,730
to do now is summarize some of the more

507
00:22:50,370 --> 00:22:48,000
common questions we had on the day in

508
00:22:52,430 --> 00:22:50,380
comments or at least the ones i can

509
00:22:55,140 --> 00:22:52,440
remember sometimes you hear things

510
00:22:59,700 --> 00:22:55,150
repeated many many times and slightly

511
00:23:02,940 --> 00:22:59,710
different different phraseology but

512
00:23:05,460 --> 00:23:02,950
let's start with our a common things put

513
00:23:08,130 --> 00:23:05,470
to us not only an expose of course but

514
00:23:11,669 --> 00:23:08,140
generally speaking and that is when

515
00:23:14,880 --> 00:23:11,679
somebody uses the logical fallacy of

516
00:23:20,430 --> 00:23:14,890
begging the question here's the typical

517
00:23:22,950 --> 00:23:20,440
example to help me it's joe alabaster so

518
00:23:25,310 --> 00:23:22,960
tell me what would you say if an alien

519
00:23:28,320 --> 00:23:25,320
came into the room then i would say

520
00:23:30,480 --> 00:23:28,330
hello alien I'd be surprised but I'd say

521
00:23:33,030 --> 00:23:30,490
hello a name but you don't believe in

522
00:23:35,510 --> 00:23:33,040
aliens well I don't think aliens are

523
00:23:37,670 --> 00:23:35,520
visiting the earth there could be lots

524
00:23:40,280 --> 00:23:37,680
life out there in the universe we don't

525
00:23:42,650 --> 00:23:40,290
know yet yes but you don't believe in

526
00:23:45,860 --> 00:23:42,660
aliens well I can put it back to you do

527
00:23:47,750 --> 00:23:45,870
you believe in aliens I haven't seen one

528
00:23:49,220 --> 00:23:47,760
but they might be real well that's all

529
00:23:54,890 --> 00:23:49,230
we're saying we haven't seen one either

530
00:23:57,290 --> 00:23:54,900
but they might be real you'll get many

531
00:24:00,230 --> 00:23:57,300
variations of this sort of statement /

532
00:24:02,210 --> 00:24:00,240
question people will basically wrap the

533
00:24:05,300 --> 00:24:02,220
conclusion up in the the question itself

534
00:24:07,550 --> 00:24:05,310
what would you say if an alien walked

535
00:24:09,800 --> 00:24:07,560
into the room well the only way you can

536
00:24:12,140 --> 00:24:09,810
really proceed on that hypothetical is

537
00:24:14,570 --> 00:24:12,150
to assume that the premises and alien

538
00:24:17,270 --> 00:24:14,580
walked into the room but you'll get this

539
00:24:18,980 --> 00:24:17,280
with what would you say then skeptic if

540
00:24:21,470 --> 00:24:18,990
you saw a ghost or what would you say

541
00:24:24,080 --> 00:24:21,480
skeptic if someone could really bend the

542
00:24:26,180 --> 00:24:24,090
spoon and the answer is well then

543
00:24:29,240 --> 00:24:26,190
someone could really bend a spoon there

544
00:24:31,610 --> 00:24:29,250
I can understand what they're trying to

545
00:24:33,350 --> 00:24:31,620
do they're trying to understand where

546
00:24:35,240 --> 00:24:33,360
we're coming from but and then they're

547
00:24:38,540 --> 00:24:35,250
trying at the same time to get us to

548
00:24:40,120 --> 00:24:38,550
admit that we're wrong basically that's

549
00:24:42,950 --> 00:24:40,130
they're begging the question is

550
00:24:45,680 --> 00:24:42,960
ultimately there their aim is to try and

551
00:24:47,000 --> 00:24:45,690
trick us into admitting we're wrong a

552
00:24:50,750 --> 00:24:47,010
lot of people have this overwhelming

553
00:24:52,910 --> 00:24:50,760
desire to beat the skeptics get the

554
00:24:56,720 --> 00:24:52,920
better of the skeptics it's quite

555
00:24:58,160 --> 00:24:56,730
interesting often at this sort of event

556
00:25:00,940 --> 00:24:58,170
there a lot of people there who come

557
00:25:05,210 --> 00:25:00,950
along who believe in the afterlife or

558
00:25:07,760 --> 00:25:05,220
spirits or something vaguely similar to

559
00:25:10,250 --> 00:25:07,770
that and here's another thing that

560
00:25:12,290 --> 00:25:10,260
they'll do they'll try to wrap up

561
00:25:17,210 --> 00:25:12,300
conventional science in their argument

562
00:25:19,250 --> 00:25:17,220
you know what they put to us to make

563
00:25:20,930 --> 00:25:19,260
their case and a typical comment would

564
00:25:23,450 --> 00:25:20,940
be like this

565
00:25:25,790 --> 00:25:23,460
you know that Stephen Hawking says that

566
00:25:30,230 --> 00:25:25,800
there are at least 11 other dimensions

567
00:25:32,840 --> 00:25:30,240
are you saying that he's wrong now there

568
00:25:34,820 --> 00:25:32,850
we have sort of argument from Authority

569
00:25:36,680 --> 00:25:34,830
but it really doesn't matter they're

570
00:25:38,720 --> 00:25:36,690
trying to use something that they

571
00:25:41,650 --> 00:25:38,730
perceive to be credible Stephen Hawking

572
00:25:44,240 --> 00:25:41,660
in this situation to make the case that

573
00:25:46,810 --> 00:25:44,250
spirits are real if you can follow what

574
00:25:49,360 --> 00:25:46,820
I'm saying this happens again and again

575
00:25:52,340 --> 00:25:49,370
but then you can try to get them back to

576
00:25:53,330 --> 00:25:52,350
back to proof so well but if Stephen

577
00:25:54,530 --> 00:25:53,340
Hawking says that that's very

578
00:25:57,260 --> 00:25:54,540
interesting but if you're claiming

579
00:25:58,820 --> 00:25:57,270
you're talking to a spirit we well we'd

580
00:26:01,400 --> 00:25:58,830
like to would like to have good evidence

581
00:26:04,070 --> 00:26:01,410
of that as I mentioned before on the

582
00:26:06,230 --> 00:26:04,080
table at the expo the Australian

583
00:26:08,600 --> 00:26:06,240
skeptics brought along boxes and boxes

584
00:26:10,640 --> 00:26:08,610
of the magazine the skeptic the journal

585
00:26:13,790 --> 00:26:10,650
from Australian skeptics recent back

586
00:26:16,190 --> 00:26:13,800
issues to give away we think that's a

587
00:26:18,050 --> 00:26:16,200
pretty worthwhile sort of outreach the

588
00:26:19,340 --> 00:26:18,060
majority of people who came by the table

589
00:26:22,670 --> 00:26:19,350
the majority of people at the expo

590
00:26:25,940 --> 00:26:22,680
happened to be female and this was a

591
00:26:29,770 --> 00:26:25,950
typical response when people walk by and

592
00:26:32,780 --> 00:26:29,780
we simply offered them a free magazine

593
00:26:35,930 --> 00:26:32,790
I'll take one for my husband he's the

594
00:26:38,110 --> 00:26:35,940
biggest skeptic in the world it's the

595
00:26:41,030 --> 00:26:38,120
age-old question why there are more men

596
00:26:43,790 --> 00:26:41,040
involved in skepticism than women I

597
00:26:45,620 --> 00:26:43,800
don't know that's certainly changing we

598
00:26:47,300 --> 00:26:45,630
might flip that a little bit and say why

599
00:26:51,350 --> 00:26:47,310
they're more women involved with the

600
00:26:53,990 --> 00:26:51,360
spiritual new-age sort of whoo whoo it's

601
00:26:57,710 --> 00:26:54,000
a I don't know the exact breakdown that

602
00:26:59,810 --> 00:26:57,720
seems to be the case as I said before a

603
00:27:02,210 --> 00:26:59,820
lot of people were amused or bemused to

604
00:27:04,100 --> 00:27:02,220
the skeptics were there and when people

605
00:27:05,980 --> 00:27:04,110
came by would often say would you like a

606
00:27:08,510 --> 00:27:05,990
magazine or would you like to chat and

607
00:27:10,940 --> 00:27:08,520
the typical reply would be something

608
00:27:14,000 --> 00:27:10,950
like this

609
00:27:16,700 --> 00:27:14,010
ah I'm not a skeptic oh I think you're a

610
00:27:19,820 --> 00:27:16,710
skeptic what would you say if I told you

611
00:27:22,129 --> 00:27:19,830
I could fly around the room I'd want you

612
00:27:24,440 --> 00:27:22,139
to prove it well that's exactly what

613
00:27:27,820 --> 00:27:24,450
we're saying to these other claims were

614
00:27:31,430 --> 00:27:27,830
hearing now that's not a bad angle

615
00:27:33,529 --> 00:27:31,440
because it gets people thinking when you

616
00:27:35,389 --> 00:27:33,539
say to them that all you're after is

617
00:27:38,990 --> 00:27:35,399
what they've just asked of you that is

618
00:27:41,230 --> 00:27:39,000
proof it's interesting to see a lot of

619
00:27:43,490 --> 00:27:41,240
people it's almost like their brains

620
00:27:46,250 --> 00:27:43,500
clicking over a gear it's it's it's

621
00:27:47,779 --> 00:27:46,260
quite a worthwhile thing another thing

622
00:27:50,029 --> 00:27:47,789
we had on the table but from the

623
00:27:53,060 --> 00:27:50,039
magazines and a power balance bracelet

624
00:27:54,470 --> 00:27:53,070
or two and some ear candles to explain

625
00:27:57,230 --> 00:27:54,480
to people that we think they're a bad

626
00:27:59,480 --> 00:27:57,240
idea was a set of dowsing or divining

627
00:28:02,240 --> 00:27:59,490
rods now periodically would get those

628
00:28:05,029 --> 00:28:02,250
out and show people how they appear to

629
00:28:06,710 --> 00:28:05,039
work lots of people coming to the expo

630
00:28:09,110 --> 00:28:06,720
certainly believed in dowsing and

631
00:28:12,440 --> 00:28:09,120
divining using pendulums and dowsing

632
00:28:18,950 --> 00:28:12,450
rods and sticks and this was the

633
00:28:21,259 --> 00:28:18,960
reaction of one lady who came by you

634
00:28:22,940 --> 00:28:21,269
have dancing rods yes we like to

635
00:28:25,399 --> 00:28:22,950
demonstrate how we think they might work

636
00:28:28,070 --> 00:28:25,409
it's quite interesting I just bought

637
00:28:31,759 --> 00:28:28,080
some really maybe you'd like to apply

638
00:28:34,220 --> 00:28:31,769
for our $100,000 challenge 100,000 for

639
00:28:36,860 --> 00:28:34,230
dowsing but people do it all the time

640
00:28:38,990 --> 00:28:36,870
well if you can do it under agreed

641
00:28:41,629 --> 00:28:39,000
conditions will give you a check for a

642
00:28:47,000 --> 00:28:41,639
hundred thousand dollars thanks the

643
00:28:48,710 --> 00:28:47,010
money is as good as mine finally a lot

644
00:28:51,200 --> 00:28:48,720
of people are surprised that they're

645
00:28:53,870 --> 00:28:51,210
strange skeptics offer a a truckload of

646
00:28:56,440 --> 00:28:53,880
money for evidence of the paranormal and

647
00:29:00,259 --> 00:28:56,450
supernatural especially at a paranormal

648
00:29:03,740 --> 00:29:00,269
Expo and this was typical of some of the

649
00:29:08,400 --> 00:29:06,480
there is a room full of psychics here

650
00:29:09,810 --> 00:29:08,410
yes and would be happy to give somebody

651
00:29:11,940 --> 00:29:09,820
a hundred thousand dollars if they can

652
00:29:13,560 --> 00:29:11,950
just do what they claim they can do so

653
00:29:16,800 --> 00:29:13,570
you'd want someone to do something

654
00:29:19,020 --> 00:29:16,810
psychic on the spot hey no we'd work of

655
00:29:21,420 --> 00:29:19,030
them very closely and carefully come up

656
00:29:24,870 --> 00:29:21,430
with in a greed test they can do later

657
00:29:30,060 --> 00:29:24,880
then why hasn't anyone ever won the

658
00:29:32,970 --> 00:29:30,070
prize the fact that nobody has ever won

659
00:29:36,030 --> 00:29:32,980
the prize in over 30 years of Australian

660
00:29:37,920 --> 00:29:36,040
skeptics offering a price says to some

661
00:29:40,080 --> 00:29:37,930
people that we are cheating we have to

662
00:29:43,340 --> 00:29:40,090
be cheating they know psychic ability is

663
00:29:46,050 --> 00:29:43,350
real or their particular claim works and

664
00:29:48,450 --> 00:29:46,060
if we've been testing claims for 30

665
00:29:51,600 --> 00:29:48,460
years plus and having awarded the prize

666
00:29:53,580 --> 00:29:51,610
therefore we the skeptics must be doing

667
00:29:55,710 --> 00:29:53,590
something wrong or cheating although

668
00:29:57,600 --> 00:29:55,720
come up with other excuses like the

669
00:29:59,820 --> 00:29:57,610
spirits won't let this be test at all

670
00:30:01,560 --> 00:29:59,830
you can't test this using science which

671
00:30:04,470 --> 00:30:01,570
we know is the logical fallacy of

672
00:30:06,990 --> 00:30:04,480
special pleading and so on but that's

673
00:30:10,350 --> 00:30:07,000
absolutely common people are initially

674
00:30:11,820 --> 00:30:10,360
very surprised that we have a huge

675
00:30:14,820 --> 00:30:11,830
amount of money to do something that

676
00:30:16,680 --> 00:30:14,830
they think is everyday they're even more

677
00:30:18,570 --> 00:30:16,690
surprised to find out that the money has

678
00:30:21,420 --> 00:30:18,580
never been awarded because nobody has

679
00:30:23,910 --> 00:30:21,430
ever passed their own tests finally they

680
00:30:28,640 --> 00:30:23,920
have to come up with a rationalization

681
00:30:33,990 --> 00:30:32,100
so going along to a spiritual Expo and

682
00:30:37,310 --> 00:30:34,000
New Age Expo the mind-body wallet as we

683
00:30:39,840 --> 00:30:37,320
call it is always a good idea and I

684
00:30:43,290 --> 00:30:39,850
seriously suggest that any skeptics out

685
00:30:46,080 --> 00:30:43,300
there budding skeptics or people have

686
00:30:48,330 --> 00:30:46,090
been at it for a long time it is well

687
00:31:02,529 --> 00:30:48,340
worth your time to go to one of these

688
00:31:08,389 --> 00:31:05,840
hi this is Tim Farley you probably know

689
00:31:11,180 --> 00:31:08,399
me from what's the harm net a catalog of

690
00:31:13,490 --> 00:31:11,190
the real world harm caused by lack of

691
00:31:16,669 --> 00:31:13,500
critical thinking but that's not my only

692
00:31:19,580 --> 00:31:16,679
project i present at skeptic events I

693
00:31:21,830 --> 00:31:19,590
post a daily skeptic history fact on

694
00:31:24,289 --> 00:31:21,840
Twitter and Facebook and I blog about

695
00:31:27,470 --> 00:31:24,299
using new techniques on the internet to

696
00:31:30,950 --> 00:31:27,480
advance skepticism come over to skip

697
00:31:34,070 --> 00:31:30,960
tools com and check out my latest ideas

698
00:31:45,040 --> 00:31:34,080
but first enjoy the rest of the skeptic

699
00:31:51,800 --> 00:31:48,830
and joining me now on the line from

700
00:31:53,180 --> 00:31:51,810
cannibal town now I reckoned a Campbell

701
00:31:54,680 --> 00:31:53,190
towns one of the most haunted places in

702
00:31:56,660 --> 00:31:54,690
Australia but I'm sure our guests can

703
00:31:59,120 --> 00:31:56,670
tell us about that it's timothy graham

704
00:32:01,280 --> 00:31:59,130
hello Timothy hi Whitson thanks for

705
00:32:03,890 --> 00:32:01,290
having me on not a problem not a problem

706
00:32:05,870 --> 00:32:03,900
I'm very interested to talk with you

707
00:32:08,570 --> 00:32:05,880
because of a number of reasons one is we

708
00:32:10,700 --> 00:32:08,580
have a lot of common ground the skeptics

709
00:32:13,750 --> 00:32:10,710
and the atheist and we'll get to that

710
00:32:17,270 --> 00:32:13,760
soon but also I like to encourage

711
00:32:19,040 --> 00:32:17,280
podcasts that are really at heart like

712
00:32:20,780 --> 00:32:19,050
the skeptic zone devoted to critical

713
00:32:24,170 --> 00:32:20,790
thinking and rational thinking what

714
00:32:27,710 --> 00:32:24,180
brought about that your your podcast our

715
00:32:29,510 --> 00:32:27,720
podcast the atheist hour is a podcast

716
00:32:31,790 --> 00:32:29,520
have been focusing on outreach to the

717
00:32:34,850 --> 00:32:31,800
Atheist community for all of us we

718
00:32:36,050 --> 00:32:34,860
entered the community from a number of

719
00:32:38,240 --> 00:32:36,060
different areas number of different

720
00:32:42,530 --> 00:32:38,250
backgrounds and when we started out in

721
00:32:43,820 --> 00:32:42,540
the community it was touch and go as to

722
00:32:46,580 --> 00:32:43,830
where the people might actually turn up

723
00:32:49,190 --> 00:32:46,590
to meetings it's kind of a daunting task

724
00:32:50,540 --> 00:32:49,200
to turn up and so this provides a way

725
00:32:52,790 --> 00:32:50,550
for people to get involved without

726
00:32:54,440 --> 00:32:52,800
having to actually show their face and

727
00:32:56,930 --> 00:32:54,450
feel that intimidation it's quite a nice

728
00:33:00,740 --> 00:32:56,940
way to extend that community feeling

729
00:33:03,530 --> 00:33:00,750
that we have we also like to promote a

730
00:33:04,670 --> 00:33:03,540
sense of skepticism with our podcast and

731
00:33:06,800 --> 00:33:04,680
without group it's one of those things

732
00:33:09,410 --> 00:33:06,810
that the skeptics community has in

733
00:33:11,120 --> 00:33:09,420
common with the Atheist movement is this

734
00:33:12,830 --> 00:33:11,130
promotion of science of reason of

735
00:33:14,540 --> 00:33:12,840
rational thinking when with approach

736
00:33:17,750 --> 00:33:14,550
approach to knowledge and epistemology

737
00:33:19,820 --> 00:33:17,760
and generally believed claims it's one

738
00:33:23,270 --> 00:33:19,830
of those things we like to have evidence

739
00:33:25,370 --> 00:33:23,280
for what we believe absolutely and of

740
00:33:29,020 --> 00:33:25,380
course at heart as I said before we both

741
00:33:31,760 --> 00:33:29,030
are interested in science and reason

742
00:33:34,190 --> 00:33:31,770
although obviously in slightly different

743
00:33:36,140 --> 00:33:34,200
spheres of that but one area which is a

744
00:33:38,270 --> 00:33:36,150
huge crossover for us I would suspect

745
00:33:40,310 --> 00:33:38,280
and we were just having a chat about

746
00:33:42,740 --> 00:33:40,320
this before in one area which is in

747
00:33:45,350 --> 00:33:42,750
Australia I'm pleased to say at least is

748
00:33:47,090 --> 00:33:45,360
sort of fading into history is that of

749
00:33:49,310 --> 00:33:47,100
creationism and I'm sure you've got some

750
00:33:51,500 --> 00:33:49,320
pretty strong views about the religious

751
00:33:54,560 --> 00:33:51,510
teaching of creationism in schools

752
00:33:56,630 --> 00:33:54,570
we do indeed we are strongly opposed to

753
00:33:57,890 --> 00:33:56,640
creations and being taught not so much

754
00:33:59,660 --> 00:33:57,900
in the schools but in the science

755
00:34:01,820 --> 00:33:59,670
classrooms if a school wants to teach

756
00:34:03,230 --> 00:34:01,830
creationism as part of a religious

757
00:34:06,080 --> 00:34:03,240
doctrine we're all for that we think

758
00:34:08,360 --> 00:34:06,090
that education on all religious beliefs

759
00:34:12,020 --> 00:34:08,370
should be an essential part of a

760
00:34:13,639 --> 00:34:12,030
holistic education that anyone has but

761
00:34:15,889 --> 00:34:13,649
when it comes to teaching it in the

762
00:34:19,220 --> 00:34:15,899
science classrooms it has to go it can't

763
00:34:21,320 --> 00:34:19,230
be tolerated that's been our stands for

764
00:34:22,850 --> 00:34:21,330
many years in fact from the very early

765
00:34:24,649 --> 00:34:22,860
days of the Australian skeptics way back

766
00:34:27,020 --> 00:34:24,659
in nineteen eighty nineteen eighty one

767
00:34:30,470 --> 00:34:27,030
it was one of the very early topics that

768
00:34:33,350 --> 00:34:30,480
we were we were covering we are glad to

769
00:34:36,320 --> 00:34:33,360
see that this is more or less dying in

770
00:34:39,169 --> 00:34:36,330
this country is that as a real threat to

771
00:34:41,210 --> 00:34:39,179
the mental health of students we might

772
00:34:42,530 --> 00:34:41,220
say but certainly in our state of New

773
00:34:45,919 --> 00:34:42,540
South Wales there is an interesting

774
00:34:47,680 --> 00:34:45,929
ongoing situation with school chaplains

775
00:34:51,350 --> 00:34:47,690
and things like that what's what's your

776
00:34:53,330 --> 00:34:51,360
view on that I think our views are

777
00:34:56,030 --> 00:34:53,340
fairly well aligned in there so from

778
00:34:57,470 --> 00:34:56,040
what I've been listening to with regards

779
00:35:00,410 --> 00:34:57,480
to your podcast and the skeptics

780
00:35:02,330 --> 00:35:00,420
community we both seem to be rather

781
00:35:04,610 --> 00:35:02,340
opposed to the chaplaincy program the

782
00:35:06,830 --> 00:35:04,620
state funding of chaplains and other

783
00:35:09,470 --> 00:35:06,840
religious doctrines and institutions

784
00:35:11,030 --> 00:35:09,480
they sort of goes against that idea of

785
00:35:12,800 --> 00:35:11,040
separation of church and state which i

786
00:35:15,860 --> 00:35:12,810
think is essential for the freedom of

787
00:35:18,950 --> 00:35:15,870
belief that we all would like to have in

788
00:35:20,360 --> 00:35:18,960
a society but it's also a bit daunting

789
00:35:22,550 --> 00:35:20,370
to see the new south wales is going

790
00:35:26,120 --> 00:35:22,560
backwards recently worse Victoria has

791
00:35:28,700 --> 00:35:26,130
been progressing and that comparison has

792
00:35:30,290 --> 00:35:28,710
been quite illuminating for the problems

793
00:35:31,910 --> 00:35:30,300
we face in New South Wales not just with

794
00:35:33,410 --> 00:35:31,920
the chaplaincy program being implemented

795
00:35:36,650 --> 00:35:33,420
and being supported by the government

796
00:35:39,860 --> 00:35:36,660
but the removal of the primary ethics

797
00:35:42,230 --> 00:35:39,870
course as a easy pathway to take for

798
00:35:43,550 --> 00:35:42,240
students yeah you're absolutely right

799
00:35:46,820 --> 00:35:43,560
that's been something that we've been

800
00:35:48,350 --> 00:35:46,830
certainly burb looking at over the last

801
00:35:50,180 --> 00:35:48,360
little while it seems to me there's a

802
00:35:53,090 --> 00:35:50,190
lot of what we might call horse trading

803
00:35:54,590 --> 00:35:53,100
going on in our state parliament because

804
00:35:56,810 --> 00:35:54,600
we've got a member of parliament who's

805
00:35:58,710 --> 00:35:56,820
been in there forever the Reverend Fred

806
00:36:02,280 --> 00:35:58,720
Nile who

807
00:36:05,220 --> 00:36:02,290
met on one occasion some years back and

808
00:36:07,470 --> 00:36:05,230
he told me about little demons who

809
00:36:09,930 --> 00:36:07,480
infest people so that sort of sums him

810
00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:09,940
up a little bit he's largely laughed at

811
00:36:14,310 --> 00:36:12,010
in this country but he does have power

812
00:36:15,960 --> 00:36:14,320
in the New South Wales Government and I

813
00:36:18,960 --> 00:36:15,970
think it's the horse trading with his

814
00:36:22,560 --> 00:36:18,970
power his party that a lot of

815
00:36:24,630 --> 00:36:22,570
politicians have to face it is it's

816
00:36:26,700 --> 00:36:24,640
shocking that someone who's an elected

817
00:36:28,920 --> 00:36:26,710
official was has those views of little

818
00:36:31,680 --> 00:36:28,930
demons in that particular in this day

819
00:36:34,230 --> 00:36:31,690
and age but I don't disagree at all that

820
00:36:38,370 --> 00:36:34,240
it's there's been some backdoor trading

821
00:36:39,960 --> 00:36:38,380
going on between 0 premier and the

822
00:36:41,849 --> 00:36:39,970
Christian Democratic Party has something

823
00:36:43,020 --> 00:36:41,859
we'd love to put the wood out and make

824
00:36:45,839 --> 00:36:43,030
people realize that this is actually

825
00:36:48,089 --> 00:36:45,849
going on and it affects not just

826
00:36:50,990 --> 00:36:48,099
students but people in general with the

827
00:36:54,480 --> 00:36:51,000
policies after face day today it's yeah

828
00:36:57,210 --> 00:36:54,490
it's right and it does it does affect us

829
00:36:58,620 --> 00:36:57,220
students across all of our state of New

830
00:37:00,810 --> 00:36:58,630
South Wales that this sort of thing is

831
00:37:03,510 --> 00:37:00,820
going on and again it's an area that I

832
00:37:07,109 --> 00:37:03,520
think that we would have in common now

833
00:37:09,180 --> 00:37:07,119
just before we go on let's get the if

834
00:37:13,140 --> 00:37:09,190
people aren't interested let's get the

835
00:37:20,160 --> 00:37:13,150
URL of the podcast at the moment which

836
00:37:21,450 --> 00:37:20,170
is I believe wwd EV en te net but that

837
00:37:23,910 --> 00:37:21,460
might change but at the moment that's

838
00:37:25,920 --> 00:37:23,920
the best place people can go yeah that's

839
00:37:28,500 --> 00:37:25,930
true we also I've run off some of the

840
00:37:30,540 --> 00:37:28,510
podcast directors like iTunes spreaker

841
00:37:32,099 --> 00:37:30,550
stitch we want a number of them easy to

842
00:37:34,620 --> 00:37:32,109
find a few search for the atheists our

843
00:37:37,560 --> 00:37:34,630
now let's talk about the podcast itself

844
00:37:40,200 --> 00:37:37,570
has been going since May how often do

845
00:37:42,210 --> 00:37:40,210
you like to get episodes out our aim is

846
00:37:45,120 --> 00:37:42,220
to get el podcasts episodes out every

847
00:37:47,040 --> 00:37:45,130
two weeks we have fallen behind as it

848
00:37:48,089 --> 00:37:47,050
happens with scheduling so it falls to

849
00:37:50,970 --> 00:37:48,099
three weeks every now and again but

850
00:37:53,160 --> 00:37:50,980
we've had a philly good consistency and

851
00:37:55,820 --> 00:37:53,170
getting them out on time with a regular

852
00:37:59,099 --> 00:37:55,830
nature and how how long does your

853
00:38:01,140 --> 00:37:59,109
typical show last the Tabuk show last

854
00:38:03,300 --> 00:38:01,150
from about 50 minutes to an hour and 20

855
00:38:05,390 --> 00:38:03,310
rotate depending on how much news

856
00:38:07,500 --> 00:38:05,400
there's been in the last cycle how many

857
00:38:09,089 --> 00:38:07,510
stories we've had if we have a new guest

858
00:38:11,190 --> 00:38:09,099
and hey have a particular story they

859
00:38:12,570 --> 00:38:11,200
like to talk about that's always

860
00:38:14,460 --> 00:38:12,580
interesting to hear someone's

861
00:38:18,300 --> 00:38:14,470
background and how they got through the

862
00:38:20,970 --> 00:38:18,310
sort of the atheists journey speak to

863
00:38:22,770 --> 00:38:20,980
where they are now and we also have had

864
00:38:25,380 --> 00:38:22,780
a couple of debates one of which was

865
00:38:27,600 --> 00:38:25,390
over Deepak Chopra which was quite an

866
00:38:32,610 --> 00:38:27,610
existing discussion but worth a listen

867
00:38:34,590 --> 00:38:32,620
oh he's a funny guy he's a funny man so

868
00:38:35,970 --> 00:38:34,600
I'm just a very interested when I hear

869
00:38:37,560 --> 00:38:35,980
about how other people conduct their

870
00:38:39,150 --> 00:38:37,570
podcast now when you're doing interviews

871
00:38:42,300 --> 00:38:39,160
do you like to do them live what do you

872
00:38:43,800 --> 00:38:42,310
do them over skype I where as it happens

873
00:38:45,540 --> 00:38:43,810
we're doing this interview over Skype

874
00:38:48,510 --> 00:38:45,550
ins working quite well what's your

875
00:38:51,120 --> 00:38:48,520
what's your operation being so far so

876
00:38:53,430 --> 00:38:51,130
far interviews have been done in person

877
00:38:55,080 --> 00:38:53,440
we like to keep it rather informal

878
00:38:57,870 --> 00:38:55,090
nature sort of if there's a mistake that

879
00:39:00,090 --> 00:38:57,880
goes into the podcast it goes out more

880
00:39:02,010 --> 00:39:00,100
or less it's like that sort of the rough

881
00:39:04,320 --> 00:39:02,020
honesty to goes with it not to mention

882
00:39:06,300 --> 00:39:04,330
the fact that I do produce at the other

883
00:39:09,060 --> 00:39:06,310
end and it means significantly less work

884
00:39:11,760 --> 00:39:09,070
for me true but I like to think that

885
00:39:14,670 --> 00:39:11,770
those sort of mistakes as something that

886
00:39:15,930 --> 00:39:14,680
people can get on board with it

887
00:39:17,970 --> 00:39:15,940
something they experience themselves

888
00:39:20,130 --> 00:39:17,980
when having discussions they might have

889
00:39:22,320 --> 00:39:20,140
drained farts they might have little

890
00:39:24,810 --> 00:39:22,330
mistakes if we have that it goes out

891
00:39:27,750 --> 00:39:24,820
it's all part and parcel but welcomes

892
00:39:29,550 --> 00:39:27,760
interviews it's relaxed its informal but

893
00:39:31,740 --> 00:39:29,560
it's we try to keep it informative and

894
00:39:35,310 --> 00:39:31,750
with a nice flow I can I can appreciate

895
00:39:37,620 --> 00:39:35,320
that but I must tell you that sometimes

896
00:39:39,390 --> 00:39:37,630
I let little things like that go through

897
00:39:42,530 --> 00:39:39,400
on the skeptic zone but quite often I'll

898
00:39:45,480 --> 00:39:42,540
get the editing knife out and make sure

899
00:39:46,800 --> 00:39:45,490
sometimes I have to I tell you what

900
00:39:48,390 --> 00:39:46,810
sometimes I have to focus when

901
00:39:50,640 --> 00:39:48,400
especially when i'm doing an interview

902
00:39:54,480 --> 00:39:50,650
like this one now or I'm introducing the

903
00:39:57,630 --> 00:39:54,490
show and a great big plane comes over or

904
00:39:59,460 --> 00:39:57,640
something like that so well look I wish

905
00:40:01,920 --> 00:39:59,470
you all the best with the podcast it's

906
00:40:04,320 --> 00:40:01,930
I'm sure it's of great interest to the

907
00:40:06,660 --> 00:40:04,330
Atheist community worldwide worldwide

908
00:40:11,580 --> 00:40:06,670
because all podcasts are of course

909
00:40:14,970 --> 00:40:11,590
worldwide that URL once again www de ven

910
00:40:17,130 --> 00:40:14,980
te net and before you go are you going

911
00:40:19,230 --> 00:40:17,140
to go out one night and see if you can

912
00:40:21,090 --> 00:40:19,240
find fishes ghost the famous ghost of

913
00:40:22,530 --> 00:40:21,100
campbelltown I've been meaning to do

914
00:40:24,450 --> 00:40:22,540
that for a long time now I keep hearing

915
00:40:25,770 --> 00:40:24,460
about and hearing about it and I think

916
00:40:26,400 --> 00:40:25,780
it's on a list and i'll get it done in

917
00:40:28,589 --> 00:40:26,410
the next few

918
00:40:30,210 --> 00:40:28,599
it's no doubt i'm sure the ghost will

919
00:40:32,579 --> 00:40:30,220
still be waiting for you no matter how

920
00:40:35,819 --> 00:40:32,589
long it takes if not i'm so people keep

921
00:40:38,099 --> 00:40:35,829
telling me time and time again i'm sure

922
00:40:40,260 --> 00:40:38,109
they will but for now timothy graham

923
00:40:55,589 --> 00:40:40,270
from the atheist hour thank you very

924
00:40:57,630 --> 00:40:55,599
much thanks for having me good crashbug

925
00:40:59,549 --> 00:40:57,640
a boardwalk a skeptic wish to shock a

926
00:41:02,099 --> 00:40:59,559
desolate it's a skeptic we sell visit a

927
00:41:04,260 --> 00:41:02,109
quelle go by tana channel Garnica meet

928
00:41:05,880 --> 00:41:04,270
the skeptics on podcast target or vision

929
00:41:07,529 --> 00:41:05,890
heritage from tasha hunter to decide to

930
00:41:09,960 --> 00:41:07,539
do manual control to shuttle ago she

931
00:41:13,109 --> 00:41:09,970
touched a critical gondola station on

932
00:41:14,460 --> 00:41:13,119
its elucidation i said at least 20 and

933
00:41:16,470 --> 00:41:14,470
then we can shake member travelin

934
00:41:18,539 --> 00:41:16,480
coca-cola taught or dvd upon skeptic who

935
00:41:21,359 --> 00:41:18,549
starts a shark 1 2 which is info @

936
00:41:22,589 --> 00:41:21,369
skeptic wish bone man tova by alan

937
00:41:25,349 --> 00:41:22,599
video i made the facebook laudanum

938
00:41:27,660 --> 00:41:25,359
cottage amita facebook.com / skeptical

939
00:41:32,700 --> 00:41:27,670
star shakti natales volume into our

940
00:41:34,829 --> 00:41:32,710
insulated dharamdas van aken hi this is

941
00:41:36,839 --> 00:41:34,839
garba raas co-president of the hungarian

942
00:41:38,160 --> 00:41:36,849
skeptics society and chairman of the

943
00:41:41,069 --> 00:41:38,170
european council of skeptical

944
00:41:43,410 --> 00:41:41,079
organizations a solicitor of the skeptic

945
00:41:45,359 --> 00:41:43,420
zone you probably agree that educating

946
00:41:48,420 --> 00:41:45,369
others about to the science and critical

947
00:41:50,010 --> 00:41:48,430
thinking is an important task if you are

948
00:41:51,779 --> 00:41:50,020
eager to take part in either of these

949
00:41:55,549 --> 00:41:51,789
activities we would be happy to hear

950
00:42:01,079 --> 00:41:55,559
from you don't hesitate to contact us at

951
00:42:02,970 --> 00:42:01,089
www.skype.com for at skeptical hu they

952
00:42:05,700 --> 00:42:02,980
also recommend you visiting our Facebook

953
00:42:09,319 --> 00:42:05,710
page skeptic gustaria shot or simply

954
00:42:22,439 --> 00:42:09,329
come and join us at one of our events

955
00:42:27,489 --> 00:42:24,849
thank you for listening to the skeptic

956
00:42:29,400 --> 00:42:27,499
zone and thank you everybody stuck with

957
00:42:34,029 --> 00:42:29,410
the zone for all these years seven years

958
00:42:36,069 --> 00:42:34,039
launching entire eighth year Wow and

959
00:42:38,079 --> 00:42:36,079
thank you to all the reporters over the

960
00:42:41,169 --> 00:42:38,089
years who have come and gone my current

961
00:42:42,999 --> 00:42:41,179
reporters thank you to all the people

962
00:42:45,400 --> 00:42:43,009
the skeptic zone has interviewed over

963
00:42:48,370 --> 00:42:45,410
the years must be hundreds by now the

964
00:42:50,289 --> 00:42:48,380
show does depend on listeners and there

965
00:42:51,640 --> 00:42:50,299
would be no skeptic zoned if it wasn't

966
00:42:53,589 --> 00:42:51,650
for the generosity of listeners

967
00:42:56,109 --> 00:42:53,599
especially those who chip in a little

968
00:43:00,429 --> 00:42:56,119
bit each month and you can do that via

969
00:43:03,400 --> 00:43:00,439
paypal at skeptic zone TV just click the

970
00:43:05,739 --> 00:43:03,410
subscribe link and thank you too Fred

971
00:43:07,809 --> 00:43:05,749
the cat for being by my side for the

972
00:43:10,019 --> 00:43:07,819
past seven years doing the show and

973
00:43:12,459 --> 00:43:10,029
Adele who left us a few years ago to

974
00:43:14,259 --> 00:43:12,469
coming up next week on the skeptics own

975
00:43:18,519 --> 00:43:14,269
we still have some may notice I meant to

976
00:43:20,259 --> 00:43:18,529
play are some Maynard this week from a

977
00:43:23,469 --> 00:43:20,269
few weeks ago at the Australian Museum

978
00:43:24,759 --> 00:43:23,479
show got a little bit a little bit busy

979
00:43:27,130 --> 00:43:24,769
this week so we're going to have that

980
00:43:29,469 --> 00:43:27,140
next week also I hope to have some more

981
00:43:32,319 --> 00:43:29,479
raw skeptic with Heidi Robertson next

982
00:43:34,689 --> 00:43:32,329
week as well but for this week and thank

983
00:43:36,759 --> 00:43:34,699
you once again for seven truly

984
00:43:39,039 --> 00:43:36,769
interesting and unforgettable years this

985
00:43:45,159 --> 00:43:39,049
is Richard Saunders signing off from

986
00:43:47,649 --> 00:43:45,169
Sydney Australia you've been listening

987
00:43:51,189 --> 00:43:47,659
to the skeptics own podcast visit our

988
00:43:53,439 --> 00:43:51,199
website at wwc a petting zoo TV for

989
00:43:57,849 --> 00:43:53,449
contacts and archive of all episodes

990
00:43:59,979 --> 00:43:57,859
since 2008 and our online store please

991
00:44:03,309 --> 00:43:59,989
support the skeptic zone by following us

992
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993
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994
00:44:11,319 --> 00:44:08,689
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995
00:44:15,069 --> 00:44:11,329
subscribing via paypal for as little as

996
00:44:17,289 --> 00:44:15,079
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997
00:44:19,209 --> 00:44:17,299
independent production the views and

998
00:44:21,399 --> 00:44:19,219
opinions expressed on the skeptic zone

999
00:44:24,279 --> 00:44:21,409
and not necessarily those of Australian

1000
00:44:33,680 --> 00:44:24,289
skeptically or any other skeptical

1001
00:44:41,270 --> 00:44:37,230
did it to the true this is joe during

1002
00:44:46,830 --> 00:44:41,280
the script dude it did it to do did you

1003
00:44:51,060 --> 00:44:46,840
do did it do to do to do did it fit

1004
00:44:55,260 --> 00:44:51,070
visitor to do it's the cherry recording

1005
00:44:58,290 --> 00:44:55,270
I'm gonna sit goodness past 130 am I've

1006
00:45:00,660 --> 00:44:58,300
been up baking I having a picnic

1007
00:45:06,320 --> 00:45:00,670
tomorrow I met some muffins and some

1008
00:45:11,040 --> 00:45:06,330
zucchini loaf did it do to do to do

1009
00:45:15,300 --> 00:45:11,050
deleted it elicited to do did it did it

1010
00:45:20,120 --> 00:45:15,310
did you to do did it did it did it lead

1011
00:45:24,750 --> 00:45:20,130
you to do did it lit little it it to do